A place for those who "Trust the Fungus"

Boo.

I apologize, but I cannot endorse any timeline which casts SMB2 aside like that. ;P

Why are Koopa and Bowser considered different characters? I realize that the design of the character shifted until it finally settled, but I'm not sure if you can find any suggestion canonically that they're not the same person.

Redstar wrote:Why are Koopa and Bowser considered different characters? I realize that the design of the character shifted until it finally settled, but I'm not sure if you can find any suggestion canonically that they're not the same person.

Actually, it's funny you would say that-- I was going to make an entire thread suggesting that King Koopa and King Bowser are two different people due to their dissimilarities in both appearance and personality.

Redstar wrote:Why are Koopa and Bowser considered different characters? I realize that the design of the character shifted until it finally settled, but I'm not sure if you can find any suggestion canonically that they're not the same person.

Well think about it, in the original game Koopa was scorched in lava. We never hear of him, and then in SMB3 we get Bowser who looks nothing like Koopa. Notice here, that he only just falls through a sort of floor, not lava. Giving the idea that maybe he was knocked out in another area of the castle.

You guys are way over-analyzing this. Princess Toadstool in the NES Super Mario Bros. looks nothing like she does in later games, but that doesn't mean it's not the same character in the game.

Same thing with Koopa. He's the same as Bowser. Remember, he's still called Koopa in Japan (or was for a while).

Phlibbit wrote:You guys are way over-analyzing this. Princess Toadstool in the NES Super Mario Bros. looks nothing like she does in later games, but that doesn't mean it's not the same character in the game.

Actually no, she does look a bit like Princess Peach. They have long hair, wear the same type of dress, are basically a damsel in distress in every single meaning of the word, it's the same character.

1upmushroom wrote:

Phlibbit wrote:You guys are way over-analyzing this. Princess Toadstool in the NES Super Mario Bros. looks nothing like she does in later games, but that doesn't mean it's not the same character in the game.

Actually no, she does look a bit like Princess Peach. They have long hair, wear the same type of dress, are basically a damsel in distress in every single meaning of the word, it's the same character.

And Koopa in the NES SMB is a big green lizard that breathes fire and has a spiky shell on his back. He's the villain that captured the princess and he can be found in the castles at the end of each world. How is that not the same character as Bowser?

Phlibbit wrote:And Koopa in the NES SMB is a big green lizard that breathes fire and has a spiky shell on his back. He's the villain that captured the princess and he can be found in the castles at the end of each world. How is that not the same character as Bowser?

Good point. But I still think Koopa and Bowser are different.

Phlibbit wrote:Same thing with Koopa. He's the same as Bowser. Remember, he's still called Koopa in Japan (or was for a while).

And he's always been Bowser here (cartoons and such aside).

jka12002 wrote:Im not trying to stir things up with you guys, i just thought this would be an interesting subject to talk about on here.

The reason why i think Koopa and Bowser are two separate beings is becasue the way Koopa was killed in SMB 3 there is no way he could survive a fall like that, lava is understandable he could of easily gotten back into his shell before the lava touched him.

We've seen Bowser survive the same in NSMB. If anything, given Mario physics, lava should be the killer.

Oh, wait... that killed him in NSMB as well. It only now occurred to me that the game re-enacts both styles of NES death...

Also, Super Mario Land 2 should be where Wario appears on that timeline, rather than 3. Though technically, Yoshi's Island DS would be the start for him...

Wait, why is "Luigi's Mansion" in an alternate timeline than the rest of the series? I was always under the impression that "Luigi's Mansion" was completely canonical.

LBD_Nytetrayn wrote: Oh, wait... that killed him in NSMB as well. It only now occurred to me that the game re-enacts both styles of NES death...

Those games don't count as they're merely remakes of the original Mario game.

They are? Where does it officially say that New Super Mario Bros./Wii are remakes?

Phlibbit wrote:They are? Where does it officially say that New Super Mario Bros./Wii are remakes?

I think they're remakes. Anyways, they're still not cannon in the Mario Universe.

1upmushroom wrote:I think they're remakes. Anyways, they're still not cannon in the Mario Universe.

As a series without focus on story then none of the games are 'canon' by any traditional sense of the word, so you have to look at them in terms of how they fit into the running themes of their predecessors. Paper Mario may not fit into the Super Mario 64 type of gameplay, but it's still 'canon' to what Mario is all about.

If it's published by Nintendo, it's canon.

If it's not, then it isn't. Pretty simple stuff.

As far as I'm concerened the first lot of games in order should be:

SMW2: Yoshi's Island/Yoshi Touch & Go!
Yoshi's Island DS
Mario & Luigi 2 (Past)
Yoshi's Story
Wrecking Crew
DK/DK '94
DK Junior
DK 3
Mario Bros. G&W
Mario Bros.
Super Mario Bros.
Lost Levels
Super Mario USA/SMB 2
BSX Super Mario USA
Super Mario Land
SMB3
SMW/Wario's Woods
Six Golden Coins

If anything I'd say it goes like this

SMW2
DK
DKJr
Wrecking Crew
Mario Bros
SMB
SMB2
SMBLL
SMB3
SMW
SM64
SMSunshine
NSMB
NSMBWii
SMG
SM3DLand

There's many future Mario games coming out, so all of those would be between SM3D and SMG2. My reason behind this is the fact that it even states in the game every 100 years (or is it 1000?) The meteorite shower happens. So basicly the Mario we played in SMG1 is dead and a new Mario has arrived to fill in the shoes of the old Mario.

I also did not add any GB games in, as to me, they may be Mario games, Shigeru Miyamoto had nothing to do with them so to me they are not continuity. Yeah Wario is now a main character, but it's because of popularity.

Also Koopa is still known as King Koopa in Japan since the beginning, same with Princess Peach. It's always been the same bad guy from the beginning. Eventually in the cartoons they called him King Bowser Koopa, but in Japan he only goes by King Koopa. Peach goes by Peachi Himé.

ultimateemail5000 wrote:There's many future Mario games coming out, so all of those would be between SM3D and SMG2. My reason behind this is the fact that it even states in the game every 100 years (or is it 1000?) The meteorite shower happens. So basicly the Mario we played in SMG1 is dead and a new Mario has arrived to fill in the shoes of the old Mario.

Or by the time SMG 2 comes around, the events of Galaxy are wiped out of existance, so basically Rosalina hit the reset button in order to save the universe.

But I digress, My next lot is essentially:

Super Mario Kart
Yoshi's Safari
Super Mario RPG
Super Mario 64/Super Mario 64 DS
Mario Kart 64
BS Exitebike: Mario Battle Stadium
Mario Parties 1&2
Mario Tennis 64
Paper Mario
Mario Party 3
Mario Kart Advance
Luigi's Mansion
Mario Sunshine
Mario Golf Toadstool Tour
Mario vs. DK
Mario Kart Double Dash
Paper Mario 2
Mario Parties 4&5
Mario & Luigi
Mario Baseball
Mario Strikers

(At some point of time is the Donkey Kong Country Series)

I wonder where the Super Smash Brothers franchise would fit in to all of this, it could have a storyline similar to The Avengers.

jka12002 wrote:I wonder where the Super Smash Brothers franchise would fit in to all of this, it could have a storyline similar to The Avengers.

Well, considering all the players in the Smash series are toys/figurines I'd say it takes place in a universe other than their home games. Most likely a plane between theirs and our own.

Round 3!

Mario & Luigi 2 (Present)
Mario Parties 6 and Advance
Mario Kart DS
Mario Party 7
NSMB
Super Princess Peach
Super Paper Mario
Super Mario Galaxy
Mario Strikers Charged
Mario & Sonic at the Beijing Olympics
Mario Party DS
Mario Super Sluggers
Mario Party 8
Mario Kart Wii
NSMBWii
Super Mario Galaxy 2
Mario & Sonic at the Vancouver Winter Olympics
Mario & Luigi 3!!!
Mario Kart 7
Super Mario 3D Land
Mario Pary 9
Mario & Sonic at the London Olympics
NSMB2

And to clarify where DKC goes

Safari
Donkey Kong Country
Donkey Kong Land
SMRPG
DKC2/DKL2
Mario 64
DKC3
DKL3
Diddy Kong Racing ---> Which would then lead to Banjo Kazzoie -> Grunty's Revenge -> Banjo Tooie -> Nuts n Bolts
...
Mario Tennis 64
DK64
...
Bowser's Inside Story
DKC Returns
MK7

Tailikku wrote:Round 3!

Mario & Luigi 2 (Present)
Mario Parties 6 and Advance
Mario Kart DS
Mario Party 7
NSMB
Super Princess Peach
Super Paper Mario
Mario Strikers Charged
Mario & Sonic at the Beijing Olympics
Mario Party DS
Mario Super Sluggers
Mario Party 8
Mario Kart Wii
NSMBWii
Mario & Sonic at the Vancouver Winter Olympics
Mario & Luigi 3!!!
Mario Kart 7
Super Mario 3D Land
Mario & Sonic at the London Olympics
NSMB2

And to clarify where DKC goes

Safari
Donkey Kong Country
Donkey Kong Land
SMRPG
DKC2/DKL2
Mario 64
DKC3
DKL3
Diddy Kong Racing ---> Which would then lead to Banjo Kazzoie -> Grunty's Revenge -> Banjo Tooie -> Nuts n Bolts
...
Mario Tennis 64
DK64
...
Bowser's Inside Story
DKC Returns
MK7

Isn't Donkey Kong Land literally the same game as DKC?

I think they're meant to be portable versions of them. Or at least, they complement the story and feel of its console counterpart.

Also, no Mario Party 9? I'm offended

ultimateemail5000 wrote:Isn't Donkey Kong Land literally the same game as DKC?

No. According to the manual for DKL, Cranky sets up a bet with DK saying that he can't reclaim the hoard on an 8-bit system and he hires K. Rool to make sure that he loses the bet. DKL2 however was a crappy port of DKC2 with Kudgel and Glimmer written out. DKL3 is a completely different plot from DKC3.

Kotaku actually ran an article on several people attempting to make Super Mario timelines a few months back: The Extraordinary Quest to Put All the Super Mario Games On One Timeline

It's an interesting read, mostly in how different people approach the games and how they choose to place games within their timeline. I don't think either person gets it entirely right, but it's their research to interpret!

I'm still confused as to why Luigi's Mansion is in an alternate timeline.

I know I've added my thoughts on this but here are my new ones

SMW2--DK - DKjr - MB - SMB ---SMB2j - SMB3 - SMW ------------ SMRPG- -SM64 - Luigi's Mansion - SMSunshine ----- NSMB-
| | | | | |
SMB2(USA) SML SML2 SML3 Paper Mario Paper Mario2

-----SMG--NSMBWii-----------SM3DL---NSMB2----NSMBU--Luigi's Mansion 2 --- ??????
| | |
Super SMG2 Paper Mario
Paper Sticker Star
Mario


I do not count Mario Party, sports games, or Mario games such as ario i issing, Time achine, Hotel, or anything else such as Wario, DKC, etc. I only count SML3, because at the very end Mario does show up.Stealing a statue of Daisy or Peach?